Clarion, I'm simply making a statement that based on my year's experience, that I find it absurdly easy to follow the golden rule. You or someone else might struggle with that, but I do not. And for what it's worth, I do hope you realize that you are taking that Holmes quote out of context. He was in fact talking about belief and moral certainty, not experience (as in it might be appropriate to say "Osama Bin Laden mistook his certitude for certainty").

I can say with certitude, that I will never understand the nuances of that quote.

That is a certainty.

maybe I'm not the super genius I thought I was.

I like this one even better. Regardless of your political affiliations and feelings towards this man, mine are not of a very kind nature, this is one of the best quotes ever

"There are known knowns. These are things we know that we know. There are known unknowns. That is to say, there are things that we know we don't know. But there are also unknown unknowns. There are things we don't know we don't know."

Donald Rumsfeld

And really this thread and others like it is testament to this quote. Lets face it TSM is still a new kid on the block. The majority of the medical community has not even heard of it and the ones who have don't trust it. So we are by and large left to our own devices and as such are sort of the frontiersmen searching for and in some cases finding a lot of unknowns.

Rubbish.

I think hardcore drinkers could just as easily skip their dose, because of the way in which drinking is so ingrained, because they can't imagine life without alcohol, because it has such a grip over them.

I'm not sure where AA comes in here because I've not read the whole thread, however I have attended many an AA meeting and took quite a few tools away from those meetings which helped me with TSM.

I have given AA another go, about 6 months ago and I know I have moved on massively, AA no longer fits with me. I'm not struggling not to drink, sure it's tough but it's nothing I can't handle. I certainly no longer need to beat myself up over it, BUT when I was following TSM remembering WHY I was taking that pill kept me taking it. I went AF because I no longer enjoyed drinking, and equally as important, I wasn't prepared to go back to where I'd been and the best way to eliminate that risk was to quit totally.

Guapo, think of it this way.

I have an in-law relative who never graduated from High School, a fundamentalist type, who is cocksure that all books are evil except the Bible. He will pronounce this to anyone willing to listen. He has certitude and expresses in a cocksure manner that everyone needs to listen or burn in hell, but just because he believes that, doesn't make it so.

He mistakes his certitude for certainty.

My not so deep thoughts on this:

I use my car every day and don't know how it works. I just turn the key and drive away. I know very little about how the car works but because I know how to drive I can use my car to reach my destination. I don't give a thought about the inner workings of a car as long as it is working.

I use my computer everyday and I do not know how it works. I turn it on, press a few keys and do what I need to do. (most times ) I know NOTHING about how a computer works but because I know how to press a few keys in the right order I can use my computer to reach my goals. I don't give a thought on the inner workings of a computer as long as it is working.

I use my NAL every time I am going to drink at least an hour before I drink and I don't know why it works. I just take my pill and hour before drinking. I know very little about NAL other than what is discussed in book and forum but I do know how to take a pill an hour before I drink so that I can reach my goal of control over AL. I don't give a thought about science, psychological or philosophical reasons it works as long as it is working!

Maybe if I was not seeing results I would feel more inclined to engage in the deep discussions - I am just happy it is working and giving me some hope that I can finally get control on my long time problem of alcoholism.

I agree with you reboot. Some people really get into all the science, though, and I guess I am glad for them because sometimes I have a question and they can use their information to perhaps help me or to suggest something. Thank God for the geeks in the group, and especially the ones who can speak (write) in simple enough language for me to understand!!

xoxo Newlife

What a wonderful post Reboot.......thank you! Sanity !

Hugs, Maggie x

Great post, Reboot.

Maggie,

I have missed you glad to see you post.

Boy, I turn my computer off for a little bit...this has been an interesting read...it is always nice to improve my vocabulary.