hi Nigel,

I've been digging back through some old progress thread - both on here & on MWO - & time & time again people are complaining about not seeing results after a few months. I think UKB has it right with her update on the TSM mantra:

Nal + Alcohol + Patience = Best Chance of Success

I think it's pretty accepted that most people - aside from the fast responders - need to give it at least 3-6 months to see significant changes, so hang in there & keep the faith

-badger

Well done Nigeir, congratulations for 2 months of compliance. You are now 2 months closer to slaying this demon. Remember, you have a secret ally that is working in areas you have no conscious knowledge of. Keep the course and allow the science to work.

No, at this point I basically have no SEs at all.

Weekdays I have an alarm set on my phone to take it an hour before I get off work, and that hour goes by pretty quickly.

Pre-TSM that hour would sometimes last forever.

Nigel, don't be discouraged. Plantpro is right on the mark, 2 months compliance is to be commended. I think patience is the hardest part of this process.

nigeir

Your progress could be mine to be honest, "patients is wot we need", my friend.

Seriously it's good that we travel with the few of us that are posting right now.

The overal sense I get from those of us who are doing TSM today' everyone is motivated to stay the course and from all those who have gone before and are still posting to support us. Is it WILL WORK GIVEN TIME.

Good luck

John

Yes, time ....

Nigel, I think you said you're in the wine business. You must love a good wine, I know I do. This may help encourage you to stay the course.

Here is a tale from yesterday, and you can make of it what you will.

My wife and I went to dinner at a place with mediocre wine, but wine nonetheless. I hadn't drank anything all week because I really didn't want to, but I'm not going to pass up wine with dinner.

Anyways, took NAL, and had a glass of wine with dinner. There was a little "buzz", but nothing much. My wife indicated that she hadn't seen me drink more than one glass of wine in six months. Okay, I said " I better have 2 then" (we were celebrating, and didn't want to go home right away)

The second was like the first, maybe a little more buzz, but no reason to drink anymore. Had a third glass occurred, I would've gone past a reasonable place, gone home, and bought a bottle of wine and drank that also.

Instead, I knew a third glass would be trouble and nothing else, Plus, what do you ever really gain from drinking past that level anyway.?(Moderation management!!). I also discovered, that waiting after drinking, especially with naltrexone, that the urge to drink anymore just dies away. Last night , like it always does, it did.

I call that control, and still being able to enjoy some occasional wine, without F'ing things up. (See graph in other post). Of course that apparently makes me a dry drunk, or delusional, or in denial according to the folks in the 12-step world. (take a look at the My Way Out or Reddit posts on the subject).

I think it makes TSM A definite success in my book.

Badger is so right and I need to keep that TSM Mantra in mind too.

this really jumped out at me. I was really rather hoping that TSM would eliminate that "tipping point", but it sounds like you do still have one to some extent. I totally get what you've been saying about moderation, time away from AL, getting perspective, etc. but a magic pill - as seems to work for a fair proportion of people - would still be the ideal for me. how much - if any - effort/will-power would you say you need to stop at a sensible point? or is it a purely conscious thing like "I won't hit my thumb with this hammer because it would hurt"?

-badger

Badger, it's not willpower at all. It's recognizing what's occurring with the alcohol,and "Learning" when to stop, before the point of no return, when things go out the window.

Where would I be if I went home and drank a bottle of wine. My wife would be pissed off, I'd feel like crap, and for what exactly? I forgot to mention, that once you let the dust settle after the Glass or two of wine, you couldn't care less if you drink anyway. That also is not willpower.

It also helps to plan to limit things to a certain number of drinks, like a maximum of 2 at dinner, or no more than three over the day on a holiday. Looking back Through the haze of the past years, I just can't find any instances where drinking more than a couple of beverages at a time was a good idea.

NAL steals some of the fun out of drinking, obviously, but fortunately enough so that you can be rational about things. The bigger deal by far though, is the general lack of desire to drink in the first place, and feeling indifferent about the whole thing. That comes ultimately from inside and behavior change, not a magic pill.

thanks for the explanation Guapo. what interested/surprised me was that you still potentially had a point after which you *wouldn't* have had control, or maybe I'm misinterpreting what you said

Precisely Badger

If you drink mindlessly instead of mindfully, it's going to lead to trouble.

Let's face it, TSM has not embraced by the world at large, but it is an effective strategy, we're all creating the real world guide to it as we go through this.

When I started this, I was trying to find a way to improve things without following traditional abstinence-based philosophy. The ultimate result was unclear to me at that time. I am trying to think, how the outcome in my case could've been any better.