Hey -- People are posting all over the place about this critical topic so I thought we deserve our own thread to stay on top of things.

Here's my benzo story: I was prescribed Klonipin (clonazepam) about 15 years ago for sleep. Loved it. My MD loves benzos and gave them to me over the years for various things (Sore neck from auto accident, divorce anxiety, etc). I was up to as much as 2mg. Never knew I was dependent until an rx ran out and my long-time pharmacist advanced me a few until he could get a refill rx. I was astonished -- said I wouldn't need it and he sort of laughed. I decided to get off them and found Ashton. I started losing 10% and during that time found benzodetoxrecovery.com. There, they think 10% is too much. I thought I was doing just fine. Ironically, this is how my drinking went from probably a bit over the healthy limit (drank along with an alcololic husband for years) to an I-can't-quit situation. I found an old post from Oct 2007 on benzodetox where I said I was managing symptoms with 2 or 3 or 4 glasses of wine. I was told to "lose the booze." I did off and on for a while. By the end of 2008 I gave up trying on my own and started looking for alcohol sites -- found MWO where I learned about TSM. Here, Dr. Eskapa has told us to ban the benzo or it will hamper TSM. So we are under siege from both sides.

We are what Roy calls "GABA drinkers." Benzos have taught our body to make less GABA and as we cut benzos, we crave more alcohol to fill the GABA void. But I believe in my gut we are also endorphin drinkers and TSM will work.

I blame benzo in large part for my alcohol addiction and I intend to get rid of both.

I know we can do both if we do it right. Until my illness when I had to quit, I was starting to get results from TSM and experienced many of the subtle changes so many discuss. I also was doing great on my benzo taper, although I did not admit to my struggle with alcohol. I was going slower, but down to .2 at one point then back up to about .3 when I got ill. I'm back to .5 K because I could not explain a dose of .3 in the hospital so I just said .5.

I'm ready to start my dual titration again and I want to form a league of people who believe we CAN do both.

I'm also about to resume TSM in a few short days.

There is SO MUCH to learn about benzos. So many pitfalls to avoid. MD's are about as helpful w/ benzo's as they are w/ TSM. Here's a start:
http://www.benzodetoxrecovery.com/topic ... PIC_ID=603

Let's do this.

Lena, as you know I am with you. I am going to go off the benzo's too. The only thing that is worrying me now, after having spent hours reading the posts at the other forum is side affects from the titration. I am going to be out of state for a week in about two weeks and fear starting this now. After much thought I think it might be wise for me to wait til my feet are back on the ground here at home in case I get into trouble. I will not have access to the internet, etc. while I am away.
Still mulling this over.

Lena, many thanks for starting this thread. With reference to your statement above, I'm inclined to agree. I think alcohol does two things for me. Firstly, it helps to reduce anxiety (in the short term) and I suspect that this is alcohol affecting GABA in the brain. Secondly, it provides a 'buzz' and this is presumably alcohol affecting endorphins in the brain. As I understand it, TSM targets the 'buzz' side of things. However, if I am to win the battle against alcohol dependence, it seems to me that I also need to target my anxiety - without recourse to alcohol or benzos. Now, whilst there are other anxiolytic drugs on the market, I'm trying to address my anxiety disorders without medication. In other words, I'm going down the path of therapy. Specifically, my current therapist has started me on a programme of Schema Therapy, Trauma Therapy, Relaxation Techniques and simple, straightforward talk therapy. And, there's probably a few other bits and pieces thrown in for good measure! There is no doubt in my mind that I am a less troubled soul nowadays compared with 7 or 8 years ago.

So, I look forward to participating in this thread; it will be interesting to watch it develop.

Good luck to all fellow benzo-takers!

V.

Anxiety is an issue with so many of us benzo users. Ironicaly, because we develop torerance to benzos, our anxiety gets worse over the years, And it get intolerable if we cut back on our benzos too fast. There is a huge list of other symptoms from benzo withdrawal. We can avoid this if we make cuts small enough to allow our bodies to start making more GABA. It is the GABA deficit that causes the anxiety.

I fell off my regimen during my illness, but I'm getting back on. I take nutritional supps to help my brain heal and my body get past what Dr. Roy appropriately called "lazy" GABA making. Benzos make GABA more efficient, so our body starts making less. I take lots of vitamis, plus fish body oil and whey. There are plenty of others, and also plenty of things to avoid. One important thing to avoid is fluoroquinoline antibiotics (cipro, avelox and others). These drugs destroy GABA.

I learned all this on benzodetoxrecovery.com. I'll continue to share more info and hope you all do the same.

Well, since I'm a longtime Benzo user, I probably should participate here too.

Unfortunately, I kinda like Valium in low to moderate dosages because 1) it fixes my back injury and 2) it treats my hypomania. It's muscle relaxant properties have allowed me to have freedom of movement and freedom from pain that are almost miraculous. Its anxiolytic properties allow me to function as a normal person in society. I can concentrate and sleep 7 to 8 hours like regular people.

Now for the bad: 1) It interferes with TSM.
To me, that's a big deal. I am now on a Valium reduction schedule sanctioned by my psychiatrist. I am substituting Buspar, a non-Benzo anxiolytic, which I can stop rather quickly, if necessary, when I have finished my Valium withdrawal. Buspar's side-effects are debilitating at times; sweats, memory loss, concentration loss, disorientation. I prefer Valium, but as I said, if it interferes with TSM extinction, I must get off of it. So, I am.

Truth be told, after TSM works, I intend to be absolutely dry and get back on Valium, and get off Buspar.

Bob

Thanks for starting this thread! I am one of the benzo bunch as well. I haven't had a chance to look at the link posted yet, but plan to next. The use of vitamins/supplements sounds interesting also. I don't have anything new to post, just continuing with the tsm. Thanks again.

I am fascinated by what these "benzos" are & what they do. I don't get it. And what is GABA?? I must've missed something. Hope you all can manage the reduction of them, if that's the goal. I don't know - alcohol has covered all my bases all these years. Altho a decade ago I was on Paxil & then Prozac...thinking I was depressed. I was. Marriage sucked big eggs.

Prozac was a little hard to get off of after a year or less...even tho I was only taking 10 mg. Paxil, I took for a year at least - can't remember the dosage maybe just 10 mg., but I consider it the devil drug. Trying to get off made me feel like absolute dog caca. UGH!!

Nothing like what it seems like you people are trying to overcome. I feel for you all trying to moderate all this & think your fortitude is great! Good luck!

I received an e-mail via this forum from Dr. Eskapa and the news is just as it has been. I wish I had known this from the beginning.

Dr. Eskapa wrote:

It is my IMPRESSION benzo's do hamper extinction. It is best to get medical advice coming off of benzos depending on each case a gradual reduction as LITERATURE shows. This is only and IMPRESSION from doctors and patients I have SPOKEN with. This is an area that needs further research.

Sorry I didn't know how to cut and paste the original e-mail and I did capitalize the words I felt spoke volumes! In other words and MY IMPRESSION is WE DON'T KNOW ANYTHING FOR SURE!
I would love to have refrence to these patients experiences since we beno users are doing tsm and trying to beat this beast the same as the rest of this community.

I thought it might be good if we all posted what we are taking the dosage, etc. so we can try to study what is happening with each other. We can study each other.

At present I am taking .5mg. of klonipin in the a.m. I plan on titrating down in another two weeks.
Afraid to start the taper before vacation in case I have some severe withdrawal symptoms while away.

houtx,

I also want to withdraw from Seroxat (= Paxil). I currently take just 20mg daily. My immediate priority is withdrawing from clonazepam.

V.

My heart goes out to all of you. A couple years ago I was going thru some ridiculously stressful life changes, and was severely depressed as a result. My doctor prescribed an anti-depressant, which I took for just a few weeks. I hated the way it made me feel, and decided to substitute more natural OTC substances. I'm now so glad I didn't jump on that merry-go-round. I can't imagine how difficult it must be for you all to be challenged on two fronts - and my hat is off to all of you for hanging in there.

Please, don't give up.