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 Post subject: Re: TSM & Me
PostPosted: Mon Dec 30, 2013 1:52 pm 
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Joined: Sun Oct 20, 2013 12:57 pm
Posts: 897
JMS wrote:
Now that I have been religiously following the protocol and the golden rule, I can't speak enough about the importance of adhering to that simple guideline. I am not sure whether or not intermittent reinforcement has taken effect for me given that I had been actively reinforcing my addiction for the last 30+ years.


Variable reward is more reinforcing than guaranteed reward. So, yeah, you probably did yourself some harm.

The behavior can still be extinguished. It'll just take longer.

_________________
Pre-TSM: 50 USA units/week
Began TSM Oct. 28th 2013. Cured on Dec. 4th 2013.

I'm bloggin' it up! Check out Naltrexone Key:
http://naltrexonekey.blogspot.com/
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 Post subject: Re: TSM & Me
PostPosted: Mon Dec 30, 2013 8:28 pm 
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Joined: Fri Nov 01, 2013 7:04 pm
Posts: 69
Location: Australia
Quote:
Variable reward is more reinforcing than guaranteed reward. So, yeah, you probably did yourself some harm.


This is the nub of breaking the golden rule. I have a feeling that some folk don't really understand the way intermittent reinforcement/variable reward works to cement or increase the desire to drink.

_________________
Pre-TSM @50 Australian units per week. No AF days.
Began TSM - 26 Nov 2013
Weeks 1-12 (units/AF)
16/2 | 15/1 | 22/0 | 28/0 | 24/1 | 30/2 | 22/1 | 33/1 | 27/2 | 10/2 | 16/1 | 17/2

GOAL
<10 units pw
>2AF days pw


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 Post subject: Re: TSM & Me
PostPosted: Wed Jan 01, 2014 5:13 pm 
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Joined: Fri Nov 01, 2013 7:04 pm
Posts: 69
Location: Australia
I was out of Nal last night so I left my multi-day NYE party and came home. The risk of staying, and drinking some top shelf gin with home-made tonic, was tooooooo much. Now it's Jan 2nd and I already have a an AF day for the year. Yay me!

_________________
Pre-TSM @50 Australian units per week. No AF days.
Began TSM - 26 Nov 2013
Weeks 1-12 (units/AF)
16/2 | 15/1 | 22/0 | 28/0 | 24/1 | 30/2 | 22/1 | 33/1 | 27/2 | 10/2 | 16/1 | 17/2

GOAL
<10 units pw
>2AF days pw


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 Post subject: Re: TSM & Me
PostPosted: Wed Jan 01, 2014 5:47 pm 
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Joined: Sun Oct 20, 2013 12:57 pm
Posts: 897
You have achieved not only lower alcohol consumption but some measure of wisdom. Perhaps you're developing temperance in both senses. :)

_________________
Pre-TSM: 50 USA units/week
Began TSM Oct. 28th 2013. Cured on Dec. 4th 2013.

I'm bloggin' it up! Check out Naltrexone Key:
http://naltrexonekey.blogspot.com/
Facebook page


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 Post subject: Re: TSM & Me
PostPosted: Wed Jan 01, 2014 6:52 pm 
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Joined: Fri Nov 01, 2013 7:04 pm
Posts: 69
Location: Australia
Quote:
Perhaps you're developing temperance in both senses. :)

I like that Melissa. :ugeek:

I like the idea that the outcome of TSM can be temperance - "the trait of avoiding excess". You are right about it working in both ways. TSM gives us the physical help we need to make the necessary psychological changes that result in losing the habit of drinking.

_________________
Pre-TSM @50 Australian units per week. No AF days.
Began TSM - 26 Nov 2013
Weeks 1-12 (units/AF)
16/2 | 15/1 | 22/0 | 28/0 | 24/1 | 30/2 | 22/1 | 33/1 | 27/2 | 10/2 | 16/1 | 17/2

GOAL
<10 units pw
>2AF days pw


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 Post subject: Re: TSM & Me
PostPosted: Mon Jan 06, 2014 9:53 am 
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Joined: Wed Dec 04, 2013 9:39 am
Posts: 121
Kerri,

Thought I'd chime in on your story as it's very interesting. A few things jump out. First is the pot. I googled it and I see Austrailia has one of the highest rates of marijuana use in the world. This funny (and fake) article captures the general U.S. view of pot versus alcohol.

http://www.theonion.com/articles/alcoho ... -son,1368/

This may be from a biased perspective, but it seems as though quitting your pot use should also be part of your turnaround plan. At the very least, it has been shown to have serious de-motivating side-effects on people. But, I'd love to hear your view (I've only tried it a few times in high school and didn't really like it). How does pot make you feel? How does it compare to alcohol? What makes it "better" than alcohol, in your opinion?

The second thing that leaped out is your marriage. It sounds like, even if you were to achieve 100% sobriety, you wouldn't have the ideal life you desire in your middle years because your husband turns himself into zombie-man every night by getting drunk (and putting himself at ridiculous risk for health problems at those levels). You reasonably fear making your way in life sober while your life-partner is drunk and watching rugby all night. So, my next question is, What would your ideal marriage look like? What would you like the typical night to look like with your husband? When I picture these empty nest years (not too far away!!), I picture vacations, long walks and exercise, hobbies and chores, going to daily Mass together (and, of course, sex!).

The situation you're in is unfortunate. He should really step it up and be leading the family and the marriage into the golden years, but he's not. But, remember, you can only change you. You'd be a fool, though, to let him drag you down from the person you want to become. Once you make the changes and become a better, more attractive person, he will hopefully notice and step up his own game or, in his mind, risk losing you to all the men that will find you much more interesting all the sudden. So, besides the NOT DRINKING (a non-activity), what things would you like to do to improve your looks, your lifestyle, your future?

PS I'm not saying you need to publicly answer my questions. Just throwing them out there as food for thought.

_________________
30+ Years of Compulsive, Secret Drinking
Did TSM 1/13-6/13 and snapped the addiction
Quit TSM and got re-addicted.
Goal=No Al, No Nal

Jan = 0 Drinks, 31 AF
Feb = 15 Drinks, 23 AF
Mar = 0 Drinks, 31 AF
April = 0 Drinks, 30 AF
May = 0 Drinks, 31 AF


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 Post subject: Re: TSM & Me
PostPosted: Fri Jan 10, 2014 4:15 am 
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Joined: Fri Nov 01, 2013 7:04 pm
Posts: 69
Location: Australia
Hi Barry

Thanks for your questions and insights.

Pot - I gave it away for 3 months in the middle of last year but I drank more and used a small regular dose of codeine regularly to compensate/reward. However since beginning TSM I am noticing a change in the way pot affects me and it could be the Nal. I have been smoking pot for a long long time and it has always had a calming effect on me. Maybe it triggers my opioid receptors, even though humans have a multitude of cannabinoid receptors. It still calms me, but doesn't give me the heady hit it once did pre TSM.

Partner - I am not actually married to my partner; we have only been together five years and our relationship is a work in progress that has its own particular challenges independent of alcohol. I know I cannot make him change but I also know that modeling positive change myself will encourage him. Things have been more positive lately. I think he coming to an understanding about his excessive alcohol consumption.

Quote:
So, besides the NOT DRINKING (a non-activity), what things would you like to do to improve your looks, your lifestyle, your future?

I am studying for a new career, and I am getting a horse. I need the former to afford the latter :? :D

_________________
Pre-TSM @50 Australian units per week. No AF days.
Began TSM - 26 Nov 2013
Weeks 1-12 (units/AF)
16/2 | 15/1 | 22/0 | 28/0 | 24/1 | 30/2 | 22/1 | 33/1 | 27/2 | 10/2 | 16/1 | 17/2

GOAL
<10 units pw
>2AF days pw


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 Post subject: Re: TSM & Me
PostPosted: Fri Jan 10, 2014 4:22 am 
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Joined: Fri Nov 01, 2013 7:04 pm
Posts: 69
Location: Australia
Past the six week mark. I think I had a bit of an extinction burst last week but at the same time I was able to easily fit in two AF days when the opportunities arose. I am happy about the AFs and I started this week 7 with two more.

All in all, I am very happy with how TSM is progressing for me. I am closer and closer to deeply believing that I can become someone who doesn't have a desire or habit for alcohol.

_________________
Pre-TSM @50 Australian units per week. No AF days.
Began TSM - 26 Nov 2013
Weeks 1-12 (units/AF)
16/2 | 15/1 | 22/0 | 28/0 | 24/1 | 30/2 | 22/1 | 33/1 | 27/2 | 10/2 | 16/1 | 17/2

GOAL
<10 units pw
>2AF days pw


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 Post subject: Re: TSM & Me
PostPosted: Fri Jan 10, 2014 10:28 am 
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Joined: Sun Oct 20, 2013 12:57 pm
Posts: 897
I'm glad you're not too worried about the uptick. Some people freak, but a bit of variation is pretty normal.

You are making rapid progress, IMO. Clearly you can do this!

_________________
Pre-TSM: 50 USA units/week
Began TSM Oct. 28th 2013. Cured on Dec. 4th 2013.

I'm bloggin' it up! Check out Naltrexone Key:
http://naltrexonekey.blogspot.com/
Facebook page


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 Post subject: Re: TSM & Me
PostPosted: Sun Jan 12, 2014 2:55 pm 
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Joined: Fri Nov 01, 2013 7:04 pm
Posts: 69
Location: Australia
I have no doubt that this program can work for me, if I work for it too.

I went away for a few days for work earlier this week and on the night I returned, my partner was already drunk at 6pm, and bitching at me about stupid things when I got home. I had some important things to discuss but let them be after seeing his mood. I did not, however, get angry or respond to his mood, I just let him do his thing.

Fortunately, he was self-aware the next day that he'd been a dick, and we were able to discuss what we needed to with a good positive outcome. And he has cut his drinking down since then. I think my being on TSM is helping him too... Or maybe it is wishful thinking.... I'll have to wait and see.

If I can have an AF day today, that will be three for the week and less than 20 drinks. That would be great! Let's see...

_________________
Pre-TSM @50 Australian units per week. No AF days.
Began TSM - 26 Nov 2013
Weeks 1-12 (units/AF)
16/2 | 15/1 | 22/0 | 28/0 | 24/1 | 30/2 | 22/1 | 33/1 | 27/2 | 10/2 | 16/1 | 17/2

GOAL
<10 units pw
>2AF days pw


Top
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