RE"
"My worry now is that if it still feels just as good to drink with the medication, how would that lead to extinction? If sure doesn't feel like my endorphins are being blocked! I'm wondering how others feel when they are drinking. Do you still get high? Is it the same high?"

De-addiction occurs at a non-conscious level. Which is why 'pleasure' has little to do with addiction. Some patients still 'feel pleasure' when they drink on naltrexone but the reinforcement in the brain from endorphins released and attaching to the opioid receptors no longer takes place. Thus the patients do not FEEL the BIOLOGICAL DE-ADDICTION as it gradually happens - is removed - over time. About 80 percent simply loose interest in drinking because pharmacological extinction simply 'cuts the wires' driving the addictive mechanisms.

Dr. Eskapa -

This is a point that deserves more attention in any subsequent edition of your book, and in any conversations any of us have with journalists, because I see it mentioned in virtually every media report on Naltrexone.

Aside from slightly suppressing the "first drink effect," Naltrexone does not substantially change the experience of drinking. It still feels "good" and we can certainly become intoxicated. In my experience there is some je ne sais quoi missing, but it's so subtle that it's virtually impossible to verbalize it. The closest I've come is to say that "the magic" is missing.

The media needs to stop claiming that Naltrexone blocks "the high" or otherwise implying that it's a "can't get drunk" pill.

I think it is a point I didn't really understand- that the difference would be so subtle. I was actually more worried that the Nal would change the experience so much that I would be tempted to drink without it, just to get an "honest" drunk. Then when I had had some experience with it, I was afraid it wasn't doing anything because the change in experience was so subtle. But I do understand:patience is the key.

Yes - We all still get the same intoxicated effects from alcohol. I too, am confused b/c I can't tell the difference between one buzz or the other. I was getting rather discouraged along the way here in the last couple of weeks but today did a very simple thing: I picked up the book and reread what I had highlighted that first day.

What stuck out first and foremost, I flipped to p.123 "Stay with It;It Takes Time to Work: Research shows that the minimum time for obtaining most of the benefits from the SM is 3-4 months worth of treatment"...

'nuff said. Three to 4 months MINIMUM...head down. Eye on the ball.

My concern is that if alcoholics needing help hear that Naltrexone takes away the buzz, they might not even consider trying it. That may not be true, considering how desperate most of us have become to find a solution. It sure sounds a lot better to just take a pill before drinking than to go through the torture of abstinence. But isn't it the buzz that we crave, and wouldn't blocking that spell disaster?

The critics just love saying that alcoholics wouldn't stick with TSM if it took away their "high" - it's not like you can trust a drunk to comply with anything, right? It's irritating how all these experts are awarded instant credibility in understanding alcoholics, and that they are allowed to speak for us as a whole infuriates me! SOMEHOW, the assumed difficulty in following TSM has to be exposed as the myth that it is. I haven't lost anything "good" that I can tell so far, and believe me - if Naltrexone obviously took away whatever I loved about alcohol in the first place, I'm sure it wouldn't work for me. In my mind, it is happening in the brain behind the scenes, and I don't really notice a loss of pleasure.

I am curious as to why Canadian (and probably several others) describe that the buzz is completely gone while on Naltrexone. Maybe (most likely) the buzz is so different to each person, that trying to find a global description/experience is pointless. All I know is the positive results of Naltrexone should be explained as something that happens automatically over time, often with little or no obvious change in feeling. It's like when kids grow a few inches within a year - they didn't FEEL it happening, but the change in height proves that it did happen.

Miracles DO happen...

This is precisely why I have difficulty describing the effect the method has because it has been so subtle, but over time I just notice that alcohol is alot less of a problem just generally in life. I notice I have less of a desire as often (and this varies depending on my stress),and the same problems don't result. It is like a slow loosening of chains. So slow it is difficult to know when or how it occurs. It just does. I still drink whenever I want to and in the same manner but things turn out differently. Like sometimes I stop before I feel drunk at all and other times I still get drunk but not nearly to the same extent. Anyway, I always just take my Naltrexone one hour before. It is quite simple. Good luck to all. . Oh yeah. Buzz is not gone.

Yep yep yep - Buzz is not gone. Drunk is as drunk was. It's a matter of following the method. I cannot tell you how much reinforcement I got just yesterday re-reading parts of the book. I also met w/ my psychiatrist who prescribes the meds and while he proposes to know the SM, when I pulled out the book and quoted things, he was all surprised and like one of those people who pretends to know what they do not. Kills me. I did direct him to this website & advised him to see how this method is the new wave of treationg alcoholism. He looked at me and responded like I was delusional. But I was thinking, "You know what Mr./Dr. Hotshot?? You could care less & are taking my insurance money and doling out the meds. Let me TELL YOU.....etctetctec" And when I took over, he very soon wrote me the script and sent me on my way. No time for all that.

I am so much more informed than he is and I felt so empowered! I just told him what I am doing very enthusiastically, he typed on his laptop, asked me a few AA/abstinence-type questions, I insisted this method is working, he wrote a new Rx...it's all of 30 minutes & he charges the full 60 minutes or $160/hr to my insurance...what a freaking racket. I can't figure that one out at all. He is a damn psychiatrist...asks no questions at all about my life, my mind, my moods etc - I did go in w/o a need for all the psychological garbage. But I am am really shocked this guy does not try to delve deeper...ya know??? It's a racket. Maybe he spends more time w/ people who really need it - I hope so

So many medical doctors know how to make things so unnecessarily difficult. It must be one of the courses. Grateful I have one that listens to me but that took forever to get to. Anyway I am always annoyed to hear of people getting the runaround from their physicians. Good luck

Kris,

Superb analogy! Congratulations on your choice of words!

V.