All,

I have been AF for about a month now, so I think I am ready to say that I have hit the switch.

As you can see from my signature, I started TSM on Jan 22, 2010, then switched to TSM + baclofen on March 5, 2010.

My efforts at TSM alone are documented http://www.thesinclairmethod.net/community/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=1237&sid=9b31703f92fec65ddd8b650ac35ada22,

My efforts at combining TSM and baclofen http://www.thesinclairmethod.net/community/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=1329&sid=9b31703f92fec65ddd8b650ac35ada22.

As you can see from the signature log, my units actually increased with TSM. This is common, and has been described by Nick's "rat banging the lever" metaphor. My units decreased when starting baclofen, but probably because baclofen side effects are worsened by alcohol.

For whatever reason, I kept increasing my baclofen dosage until I was at a whopping 380mg/day (4.6mg/kg). I am convinced that habit was driving my drinking rather than addiction. Baclofen had probably cured the addiction at a much lower dosage; I, like a dope, kept on drinking out of habit. When I *finally* decided to quit, it was very easy. I quit on 7/15, and have been AF since then.

In the first 1-2 weeks, I felt a bit of craving, but nothing I could not easily ignore. I keep no alcohol in the house. Now I almost never feel craving; if I do, I take 40mg or so prn, but again this is rare. The overwhelming majority of the time, I am absolutely indifferent. I hung out with a drinking bud the other night; he drank beer and I drank soda. I remained absolutely indifferent the entire evening - no craving at all.

I was able to titrate back down very quickly. I went from 380mg/day to 200mg/day in about a week, and am now at 120mg/day. I do it "lo0p style" taking all 120mg in a single dose, somewhere around 5:00p. I'll stay here a week or two, then will try reducing more.

I have no idea if TSM worked for me or not. If I can titrate baclofen to zero, then perhaps it worked.

At any rate, I am AF now and it feels wonderful. ALL of my baclofen SE are gone, but I still have peristent breathing issues which at first I attributed to asthma. My GP checked and found no evidence for this, and prescribed an anti-anxiety medication (lorazepan). I was dubious at first, but now am convinced that anxiety is at the root of my breathing problems - it is sort of a panic attack. This is odd, since I have always considered myself a very level person.

I also have chronic sleeping issues. I have always thought that my troubles with alcohol were an attempt to drink myself to sleep. My GP has prescribed temazepam, which works well, but leaves me a bit groggy in the AM.

Hopefully, over the next few weeks I can solve the breathing and sleeping issues and for the first time in 30 years be "normal."

By the way, I am VERY grateful to have had the guidance of my GP during this process. I don't believe I would have been able to work through the anxiety and sleeping issues without this help. I went to him yesterday; when I told him that I had been AF for a month, he just about fell back in his chair. I don't think he expected baclofen to work - now he is convinced, and will hopefully be ready to prescribe to others.

For those just starting, I have some advice, especially for those who are daily drinkers with both addiction and habit to contend with.

1. Start with TSM. It is much simpler, and works for many.

2. If you decide to combine baclofen, start trying to reduce units WILLFULLY as soon as you detect SE's. For me this was around 120mg/day.

3. At around 3.0mg/kg, get serious about going AF. You may not succeed right away, but the SE's will be much milder, and as the cravings subside, you can more easily detect the switch.

4. As soon as you can manage the cravings, level the baclofen off to see if they go away. If not, increase your dosage a bit, but remain AF. Baclofen SE's while AF are 10-20% of what they are when drinking heavily.

5. Start titrating back down when you have gone one week with no cravings or with occasional cravings that are easy to manage.

That's it. Baclofen is not a magic bullet. Everyone is different, but I had to add in a bit of willpower. At least for me, there was no mythical CLICK with the switch hit; the process was more gradual, but nonetheless effective. I am very very grateful.

I'll check back in from time to time for updates.

Best,
-wort

WOW Wort - We've been corresponding & I am sooooooo happy for you!! I honestly don't know how you tolerated it so well - but I am really happy for you! Me, I couldn't handle the weight gain and the sleepiness & fog I was in all the time. Hope your breathing & sleep issues are resolved soon as well. I'm sure they will be. I keep thinking everything will be better if the drinking gorilla dies...

Wonderful news, Wort!! Keep in touch, mi amigo!

Congratulations
Wort!!!!! this gives me hope! I'm really starting to wonder if TSM is going to work for me. If it doesn't then I'll try something else

Yeah WORT

I'm with the board. I Hope it works...

I'm giving 6 more months....

Disaclaimer...9 units

Wort,

I've not yet read your links to TSM and baclofen efforts, but I find your post very encouraging. I am a creature of habit and have always attributed most of my drinking just as my daily routine, just like brushing my teeth. If you read my update I posted today I talked of anxiety. I agree there is some degree of WILLFULNESS to beat this habit, and so far I have just been too weak (lazy? indifferent?) I already have sleep issues (translation: menopause, it sucks, but I'm determined to see it through without HRT) so I don't know if I can handle a drug that makes that worse, but who knows, as you said everyone is different and perhaps I won't have that side effect. Thank you for your advice, I'll read your links and try to determine my next course of action. I'm so happy for you, can't wait 'til I get there!

-petal

Thanks Jim, Joe, Houtx and Petal.

Petal, I read over your progress thread. Are you really running out of nal? If so, I have plenty and can send you some. PM an address and I will have it to you in a day or two. This is s a very serious offer. You have put over a year into this and have made real progress; AF for weeks at a time is fantastic. Except for the past few weeks, I have not ben able to do that in over fourty years.

I also have and have had serious sleep issues - mostly my whole life. I am currently having a bit of luck with L-Tryptophan, as long as I take enough of it.

Petal, I don't think you are weak, lazy or indifferent. Nothing about this is easy. Hang in there.

Very Best,
-wort

Wort, congratulations on your 'hitting the switch' and being alcohol free for a number of weeks. It must feel great to be free from such an awful vice.

However, I would like to caution you to keep your guard up. Because you feel like you have hit the switch and shed alcohol for a few weeks, doesn't mean that you can't revert. So, be careful, please.

I am also curious about why you only gave TSM six weeks before you decided it wasn't for you. You said that you were taking in more units when on Nal, instead of less. I have read and heard that this is a common occurrence in the first few weeks.

I also have had someone here on this forum (can't remember who) recommend Baclofen to me, because I mentioned that I have some anxiety issues, as well as ADHD, for which I take Ritalin and it seems to work fairly well. I checked Wikipedia for Baclofen and read the mile-long list of completely repugnant side effects and I'm just not sure I want to go through any, much less all of them. I am seeing my psychiatrist in less than an hour, though, and I will ask her about it anyways, just to be sure.

It also seems to me that the addition of Baclofen, according to what I gathered by your posted weekly progression chart, didn't exactly reduce your number of units consumed by a great margin, either. Only when you imposed a bit of willpower on your own did you truly become AF.

Don't get me wrong, Wort. I am very happy for you and wish you all the best in managing your alcohol intake or lack thereof. I am not trying to be negative or derrogatory towards anything you have done or posted. I simply had a few questions. Congratulations, again, on 'hitting the switch.' I look forward to the day when I can say the same.

WAX

Hi Wax,

Thanks for the post - you are right on target in a few ways.

You are correct - I did not give TSM nearly long enough. Part of that was my own timeline - my goal was to AF by the end of the summer, and last March all I could tell was that I was drinking more. Again you are correct that this is common. My favorite analolgy is due to MinneapolisNick: imagine a rat conditioned to receive a treat after depressing a lever. The treat goes away, and the rat bangs on the lever frantically. You can see from my record that I was banging on that lever pretty hard.

Many report that baclofen is helpful with anxiety - in fact Ameisen makes a big point of this. I did not suffer from this before taking baclofen, but ended up developing it, at least according to my GP. I went in complaining of asthma, and in fact had a substatial attack in his office during a breathing test. He was able to determine that my passages were clear, and concluded that I was having a panic attack. He prescribed lorazepam; I was very skeptical at first, but will acknowlege that when breathing becomes difficult for me know (usually in a stress situation) a quick lorazepam does the trick. I carry it with me at all times.

You are also right on target with regard to not lettting my guard down. I have titrated down from 380mg/d to about 40mg/day, and don't really feel like I need that. On the other hand, sometimes I do get the urge for a drink "for old times sake" (with naltrexone, of course). So far I have resisted, and am still AF since 7/15. I still don't know if TSM worked - I took it one hour before drinking until 7/15. At some point I may stop baclofen altogether just to see what happens (I did once for three days), but right now I am playing it safe. I take 40mg at around 7p and have the sense that it makes me sleep better, and I feel absolutely no effects from it the next day.

Finally, you are also on target that neither TSM or baclofen did much to reduce my units until I introduced willpower. I kept expecting the switch to go CLICK and that just never happened with me. On the other hand, going AF was trivially easy, so I had probably already hit the switch and did not realize. As a daily dirinker, I had a psychological habit that I was not dealing with. A bit of willpower is absolultely essential.

I wish you the very best of luck in your efforts. Please post your progress - if you already are posting here, I will find your thread and will pay attention. MYO is another good site as well.

Very Best,
-wort