Besides the initial nausea and drowsiness that so many of us experienced in the beginning, has anyone experienced the pleassure loss that is the result of opioid antagonism?

I have recently read on MWO of members who claimed they discontinued TSM because they were not able to enjoy ANYTHING in life due the the effects of Naltrexone.

I am nearing a year of TSM and many of you know I declared victory late last spring. As far as that goes, I am still doing great. Actually, I am nearly abstinent. Other than the side effects mentioned above, I have NEVER experienced anything different about my emotional ability to perceive intense pleasure, either while Naltrexone was in my system or after washout. To be honest, I never went to much lengths to watch my behaviors under one state or the other.

For example, last summer I went a a week long ride in the mountains of N. Ga., N.C., and TN. I was staying in bike camps and the atmosphere was to party. Of course, I would take my Naltrexone and drink a few beers in the evening. During daylight hours, I would ride through the mountains, even doing the Tail of the Dragon which has 318 turns in 11.2 miles. Trust me, these were breathtaking experiences and I was totally thrilled. I was gasping as I went around every turn. I will try to link pictures so you can relate to my experience.

But I must admit I never perceived much difference in my drinking experience though others here reported a sense of "flattening". If anything, I think there was a lack of excitement in the onset of drinking but that was the one feeling I was glad to dismiss. The other difference was a significant decrease in post-indulgence hangovers on the occasions where I did drink heavily. No crying there.

As I said above, I am nearly abstinent and my reason is chemical. Let us say I chose to drink nightly, if only one drink, after taking 50 mg of Nal. My endocrine system would essentially be shut down. Even if I were to go to every other day, the wash out time would still leave my opioid receptors blocked most of the time. So my concern has switched from how much I drink to how often I take Naltrexone. An interesting shift in concern. So I have resigned to drinking once or twice a month, or even less.


I welcome a discussion along these lines.
Thanks
_sr


I am 30 pounds lighter now!!

Nice bike and the pictures were beautiful. I love that part of the country. Since taking the NAL the only side affect for me has been the taste of wine, it really tastes gross but I refuse to switch to anything else because eventually I'll just turn away from it.

No, I have not lost interest in other things a matter of fact the fall colors just finished here and I have to say they were the most beautiful I've seen in years, you know the kind that makes you go wow every 2 seconds. That's my vote.

corkit

Beautiful pictures! I've never been to Georgia, love those mountains. I'm with corkit on the only side effect I really notice is that my wine tastes awful (but do I stop? noooooo). I've never been much of a spirit drinker so switching is not an option for me. I really don't experience any pleasure loss in anything else that I've always taken pleasure in. I'm only taking 25mg of nal.

petal

Okay, the consensus seems to be that Nal does not cause a significant loss of pleassure.

I am suspicious that there are some distractors over at MWO who were never on TSM but are making claims to discourage others. Not to big a deal but I would hate to see others not try the method due to disinformation.

but you are right though. that is as dark as they get! BTW, I took a serious bee sting that day and I have never road wearing shorts again. Pretty stupid, anyhow.

I think I can relate to the "flattening" - If I've been on Nal for several days in a row, my mood is blah, not good, not bad. I'm sure this is also related to alcohol consumed during that period. I also lose my drive to work out and work hard and really enjoy time with the kids. It's gotten better now that have more AF days.. can still still feel the Nal and can notice a big difference if I manage AF days in a row. Hoping AF days will increase and the good feelings along with it.

Compared to the huge benefits of TSM, I'll suffer a little blah-ness Eventually, I hope the pendulum moves to the side where the desire to not have Nal in my system is stronger than the desire to have AL in my system. Right where you are you...

Thanks for your thoughts on this...

I'm afraid I'm also someone who experiences a definite flattening, in fact even a downward emotional spiral, when I take NAL every day (which I should, since I'm a daily drinker). It's something I'm struggling with figuring out how to handle, since the NAL also has already been really helpful in keeping my drinking moderate as well. Right now I'm trying to figure out the lowest dose I can go and still get the blockade, while also keep working toward the extinction effect. I think the NAL does work differently in different people (and I'm also someone who's enormously sensitive to any medications). I suspect I might be one of those with the endorphin deficient gene, which might be why alcohol in the past worked so well for me as an anti-depressant. So therefore the total endorphin blockade I've been experiencing when I take NAL daily would feel like a double whammy. I've decided I'm going to be positive about this though and use it as even more incentive to have AF days. Also to make more of an effort to go out and smell the roses or look at the fall leaves since I don't have a motorcycle, though my son insists he's going to buy a Ducati when he turns 18 next year.

Sabrina, Virginia
There was so much going on the first month or two that I don't think I could have sorted one emotional state from another, or at least the cause.

I was telling the wife that another reason I did not feel that something was missing was possibly because I felt I was just getting a rest. Nal may have had a desired calming effect for me.

I have been an endorphin junky most of my life. As long as I can remember, I flirted with risk and danger. Skydiving, motorcycles, Scuba, Cliff-climbing, etc., etc. When I couldn't do these things, I felt I was going through withdrawal. Years ago I had a shrink tell me that I intentionally introduced chaos into my life. It is true that when things were too quiet in my life, my pattern was to inject a crises into it. I am one of those that would function best under pressure.

I suspect that the Nal was giving me a little rest. I do feel more normalized than ever. More grounded and balanced. This has been a win-win game for me.

Whatever the side effects, I would regard them as a small price to pay for losing the addiction to alcohol. As time goes on, you will have sequential AF days and be able to have wash out. The fun with that is that you get those extra opioid receptors to bind to. Christmas is right around the corner.

I was just looking for the link (was it from Nick or Evan?) that posted last week. I wanted to read it over again but can't find the thread on this site with the link. It talked about endorphins. So, Nick or Evan, could you tell me where the post is? It talked first about how we have to keep posting the basics for the newbies and if there was a way to keep the topic on top of the site or something (ie: the basics). I remember Q chimed in too. Sorry I don't remember the details but in that thread Nick or Loop had an interesting thread about the endorphins that I wanted to read because I was AF last night and want to try and do a day or two more to experience the "wash out" that was talked about, etc. Again, sorry I am not more clear on this and I can't understand why I can't find the thread. It started on this site with a link to the mwo site. Thanks!

http://www.thesinclairmethod.net/community/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=1035&sid=8920f1846388bca3d65b0f6b3bf00ab4 -E