ok, i'm sure now you have the unsweetened

ok, Corkit, just one more question how much total liquid do you drink? If it's a liver cleanse don't you have to drink lots of it? I mean one large glass? One cup? a liter? Sorry to be such a dope but I need to know!!

Hi 8,

I'm really pleased that you started this thread.

I bought a copy of Patrick Holford's book just two days ago and I think it's excellent. I am working my way through it at the moment to determine what I need to do to clean up my scrambled brain (and body). I have to be honest; when I first learned of this book, I was very skeptical about it. But, as a scientifically-trained person myself, I find Holford's approach to make good scientific sense. I now consider this to be the most exciting discovery I have made since TSM itself. I am convinced that Holford's method will help me a great deal. As the proof of the pudding is in the eating (literally), I am eager to get going.

As you will no doubt be aware, I recently started the thread entitled Milk Thistle. I am now taking this with a view to being kind to my liver.

It is my intention to add to this thread as I make new discoveries about this most important part of addressing my dependence on alcohol.

V.

I can only tell you the way we do it, we drink at least two glasses a day for a week then go off of it for week do that same pattern for a couple of months and you should be fine. You can even skip a couple of months if you want but hey why skip it's good for the liver and your kidneys.

And I guess in Europe they've been treating alcoholics with Milk Thistle and I could be mistaken, but has even helped those with cirrhosis.

It also goes by the name Silymarin (the supplement bottle). You can go to Whole Foods or a health store (but I would recommend Whole Foods) as they will have a vitamin Department head that will know which brand has the most potency and is the best.

It ain't cheap but by the threads, you cats paying $100 for a months worth of Nal. Its probably no more than $40 for couple hundred. Here's an overview link.

Virgil I'm so glad you started that link. I'll have to take a peak...

http://www.truestarhealth.com/members/c ... 3P1A3.html

There is a recommended daily dosage for Alkies and its probably in that book you guys have.

Glad you started this thread seems like a lot of folk didn't know about that. I'm spoiled as I was in the health food industry for many years.....Best, Jim

Gant is a card-carrying quack. Check out the respected Stephen Barrett M.D's quackwatch.org, or go directly to this: http://www.quackwatch.org/11Ind/gant.html

Some's snake oil, some's ain't. Stuff on the Internet can be misleading. Just a yellow flag.

Mike

I hate to be a skeptic on this stuff, but I think evidence-based science is what we should look for. TSM appears to be just that. Holford? See: http://holfordwatch.info/holford-myths/ and make up your own minds.

All this "wiffy" stuff has turned me off MWO. TSM? It's out there as a solid theory that can be challenged, verified or disproved based on hard facts and data using the accepted steps of the Scientific Method. Evolution, for example, is full of potential potholes because we don't have all the minute details, but the broad picture is unchallenageble. That picture has held up to evidence-based scientific scrutiny for over a century. That's what science is all about. So far, although not yet "cured", I'm in TSM's corner, bloodied but still fighting.

Mike

well this is certainly a fine kettle of fish Gant's a bum, Holford's a fraud... we're all so needy!! We want help. We want to feel better. We want to be in control of our drinking. Man, I've been stuffing myself with capsules recommended by Gant that have been making me sick to my stomach - all with the hope of being well. I guess my pure neediness is to blame. We really are at the mercy of these people. Do we feel comfortable with Dr. Sinclair? I do. Frankly anyone who can work with the dour Finns for years and years (do you know they have their own national version of the Tango which is all the rage there?) and not go batty, gets my vote.

I now feel like an idiot recommending Gant!!!

Hi Mike,

As I said above, I was skeptical when I was first introduced to Holford's book. However, it is my view as an applied scientist that Holford's approach is a good example of evidence-based science. In the long term, I may be proved wrong but I am going to put his methods to the test. I have nothing to lose and, potentially, a lot to gain.

All the best.

V.

I have to throw in my two cents and entirely agree with a single line LoOp threw out there. Exercise.

I am an exercise freak. Because I'm vain and want to maintain a sleek build? OK, yes, that's part of the reason, I admit it. But that would not be enough to make me exercise six days a week since I was a freshman in college. No, it's the mental health benefits! I cannot tell you what a positive impact exercise has on my mood in terms of combatting both minor cases of depression and anxiety, neither of which I'm medicated for, but would be, but/for my daily exercise. Talk to any runner and they will tell you that (1) the biggest reason they exercise is because of the endorphin rush and tremendous mood benefits and (2) that the benefits of daily exercise on your mental health have been completely ignored in the scientific literature.

Now I know that if you are a big smoker and big drinker, exercise probably isn't your thing. But it should be! Why? Because a lousy mood, be it anxiety, depression or whatever, is most frequently the reason we reach for the quick fix in the way of booze or a cigarette. But there is an entirely different way to lift your mood and, unlike booze or cigarettes, it not only works on the long-term, but it's great for your health.

The key to any exercise regimen is baby steps. Start out with a daily walk for as far as you feel comfortable. Do not over do it at first -- the biggest obstacle to beginning a workout regimen is that people start out all hyped, over do it, feel pain, and quit. You should not feel much, or any pain, when you exercise. Start with walking and then walk farther. Take stairs. Graduate to jogging, or an exercise bike, or stairmaster -- anything that will elevate your heart rate and make you sweat. I guarantee you that if you get to the point where you can run a few miles a day, your life will be changed one thousand times more than any vitamin/amino acid cocktail!

Just my two cents. Try it! And by the way, when you start to lose that belly and your body gets more tone, it will be a boost to your self-esteem. Also, if you have sleeping issues, a daily workout helps tremendously with a good night's sleep. You will gradually notice your belt size getting smaller and people will compliment you for your improved appearance. You will also have WAY more energy in general. Lastly, exercise is great for reducing your cholesterol and lowering your blood pressure and maintaining your general good health. I've missed work from illness maybe twice in the last twenty years. (Now hangovers, that's a different story.) My dad, a daily jogger, never missed work from college to retirement at age 65. I'm convinced the fact that I have kept in shape despite my preposterous drinking habit has been key to keeping me healthy all these years.

Happy workout!

My best,

RIchard Simmons