I haven't recently witnessed anyone engaging other people in such an intelligent, conscientious, patient and objective way such as 1-4 has done over on soberrecovery. There are 200+ replies to his thread and many of them read like this: "Wow, this is a very good topic and a fascinating conversation." Yet..the thread is locked... ...

I share his most recent sentiments regarding the status quo over there but I would move one word from one place to another:

one4 - I hope you have given up on SR permanently as I did after getting banned. They feel threatened by a successful 21st century medical solution to an old problem that has plagued mankind for thousands of years. When people feel threatened, they often resort to unsavory behaviors as you have experienced. The SR moderators and administrators bear a heavy responsibility with their abuse of power for causing much suffering and possibly many deaths of their members by their actions. We tried and were rejected. I think we should continue to publicize TSM, but with the realization that most folks will not embrace it.

If we think back to how each one of us found TSM, for most of us, it was because of the failures of the traditional out-dated methods. We were driven to find a solution for our alcoholism, perhaps more than most, and we found the cure here. As long as we keep a public presence, people will find us. After all, we found it, so others can too.

Bob

loop

it reads better like that

That thread and the one on the sinclair method were the two most viewed threads, by far, over there, over the last 3 months. That says something. I had several private messages from members sending their good wishes and disagreeing with the censorship etc. I also had one telling me not to let the door hit my ass on the way out!

Bob - yes I've given up on that site (must resist temptation to wrestle with pigs.....the pig might enjoy it and you'll both end up covered in yurdick ). I agree about the heavy responsibility they bear. My purpose on the site as exactly as I stated over there - I genuinely did want to learn, and felt that debating (and not in the sense their moderators use that word) ideas with those who may probably disagree with me was a good way to do that. If I made anyone there think more deeply about the problem, or helped anyone to resolution of their problem - by TSM or otherwise then I feel I achieved something.
Unlike you or many others here I didn't find my way here after numerous failures with other methods (yay me! ) - I was just lucky I found it. If and when it works for me I'll be shouting it from the rooftops, don't you worry

Guys -- God bless you for being true believers but please start thinking about when it's time to let this thing go. Each time I post (well, most times ), I think, How will this appear to someone who just found the site? SoberRecovery's stated mission is basically to be a feeder for their pricey rehab facility clients, for whom they do marketing. So in a way, they're not hypocritical; they put it out there. Sure, most folks bumble on to there thinking they've found a resource that might keep them outta rehab. They didn't read the fine print.

At some point it starts to seem like the kids riding their bikes across the widow's lawn.

I agree with you Lena as i said over on 1-4's progress thread.
I am concerned that 'we' may come across no differently than the other zealots- just trying to promote a different type of snake oil or religion! for what its worth in my experience people tend to be more open to new/revolutionary thinking when they go seeking something themselves. Just look at the rate of growth on this site in the past few weeks. TSM will inevitably grow in popularity and will eventually reach some kind of critical mass.

Lena

I understand what you're saying. However, two pertinent points in this instance are:

a) I had no motives in posting over there except purely personal. I wasn't acting as a spokesman for this site, or as an evangilist for TSM. I responded to existing threads and asked questions of my own.
b) there was a disgraceful abuse of editorial privilege by the moderators to clearly give a false impression of who I was and what my motives for posting were. I have no recourse to address that there, so on the off chance that someone from there finds us here, this thread acts as a statement of record.

I also think your (probably correct) interpretation of their mission doesn't tally with what they state. When someone signs up the 'principles' of the site include intellectual freedom and mutual respect for all paths to recovery. So, they ARE hypocritical. I read the fine print carefully and yet was repeatedly censored and misrepresented, at the whim of people hiding behind vaguely construed 'rules' which effectively mean 'we can do what we like with you'

As for someone finding this site - they'll find somewhere with a grown up attitude to discourse and a genuine respect for others views, but most importantly somewhere whose true focus is on helping people beat alcoholism. And that my friend, is where we differ from them - they've lost sight of the aim in pursuit of the ideology.

Everything you say is true. I don't doubt it for even a second. I don't think you've done anything wrong at all.

I still think there's no point in beating our heads against the brick wall that is SoberRecovery. Or throwing water balloons at them.

And I think the people who visit us for the first time would rather see the excitement of -- at last -- a real solution to alcohol addiction than read about our efforts break the windows of their fortress.

If you feel the need to continue to post about this, then by all means do. We're not into censorship here. I'm just looking forward to the day when we have moved on from the SoberRecovery misadventure. My two cents.

I'm doing it again, amn't I ? LOL

the wrestling with pigs bit?

Ok.....deep breath. I'm done!

My posts about tsm got deleted as well. I was only on that site for a week or so and it was the most depressing thing ever! Post after post of relaspe and failure, obsessions and cravings. Even those who had 10+ years were stilll labeling themselves addicts and alcoholics....you've been sober 10 tears and still need to obsess about every day? No thanks. Eventually this method will become mainstream, and future generations will roll their eyes at addiction treatments like 12 steps the way we roll our eyes at blood letting. It's just a shame the thousands who will due from their addictions when a successful treatment is available.