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 Post subject: How did you learn about TSM?
PostPosted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 7:32 pm 
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Joined: Fri Aug 27, 2010 9:31 pm
Posts: 250
I found it on Wikipedia.

In November, I did my 8th or 9th round of outpatient treatment. The shrink gave me the monthly shot to help manage cravings while trying to abstain. I had a bad reaction to the shot and he agreed to give me the naltrexone pills instead. I stayed sober until this summer, but suffered a terrible family upset (my mentally ill sister committed suicide...very long story) and I went off the wagon again. In spite of my best efforts and plenty of AA support, steps, etc I was still struggling. I pulled the naltrexone pills out of my medicine cabinet and was planning to take them to help with the cravings. After I did, I googled "naltrexone" to verify the side effects, recommended dosage, when how to take it, etc....I was shocked to learn how I was using naltrexone incorrectly.

I found out about TSM and decided to give it a go. Thank you for whoever got this on Wikipedia otherwise I wouldn't have known.

Sincerely, BTDT

_________________
Started Aug 25
Wks 1-4: 35, 58, 32, 47
Wks 5-8: 60, 44, 58, 48
Wks 9-12: 50, 41, 63, 46
Wks 13-16: 45, 40, 40, 39
Wks 17-20: 50, 0, 24, 33
Wks 21-24: 43, 52, 42, 35
Wks 25-28: 55, 52, 45, 39
Wks 29-32: 59, 5, 32, 35


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 Post subject: Re: How did you learn about TSM?
PostPosted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 9:20 pm 
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Joined: Sun Jun 27, 2010 6:52 pm
Posts: 176
beentheredonethat wrote:
I found it on Wikipedia.


I had been doing a Web search for alternatives to AA and ran across something about baclofen. I Googled that and this site was one of the ones that popped up. Just shows how much we really need to get the word out.


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 Post subject: Re: How did you learn about TSM?
PostPosted: Sat Sep 04, 2010 8:19 am 
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Joined: Fri Sep 03, 2010 5:02 pm
Posts: 90
hey,I found the sinclair method kind of indirectly..I had been in and out of aa for years..I could never quite put my finger on what was wrong..Then I started reading a sight called the orange papers.This guy does a great job of describing what is wrong with aa..He also has a list of other things that work better..On that list i learned about Stanton Peele and harms reduction..In his toolbox he mentioned naltrexone.So I googled it and bingo..I started reading online about the sinclair method and it just clicked..That was what is so wrong about Aa..They are all just sitting there in fear of the next relapse..Its funny,Aa will never endorse Tsm because they dont believe in anything but complete abstinence..I also looked into Stanton Peele and he will not get behind tsm because he does not believe that addiction is a disease..Any ways I got eskapas book and this seemed like the most open minded scientific approach..I talked my dr.into giving me a script for naltrexone..I am only three days on the pill but already there is new hope that this may work..Anyways,that is how I found this site..I would also highly recommend anyone who feels they were mind screwed in Aa,to check out the orange papers..Im not bashing Aa..But ,the heavy brand that I was involved in really did a number on me..It left me very sceptical that something else might work..Have a good day all.


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 Post subject: Re: How did you learn about TSM?
PostPosted: Sat Sep 04, 2010 12:56 pm 
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Joined: Tue Mar 09, 2010 10:39 pm
Posts: 626
I was desparate. I had relapsed in AA yet again. Every time I relapsed it was tragic and guilt ridden. I would stay sober a few months, work it, live it, trying hard! But I would still drink. No matter how hard I prayed, worked with others, worked the steps, went to meetings every day, read the book, I kept relapsing. Whenever I went back, I would volunteer to read "how it works" at the beginning of the meeting.
For the unfamiliar, "how it works" is a part of the book that says this:

"RARELY HAVE we seen a person fail who has thoroughly followed our path. Those who do not recover are people who cannot or will not completely give themselves to this simple program, usually men and women who are constitutionally incapable of being honest with themselves. There are such unfortunates. They are not at fault; they seem to have been born that way. They are naturally incapable of grasping and developing a manner of living which demands rigorous honesty. Their chances are less than average. There are those, too, who suffer from grave emotional and mental disorders, but many of them do recover if they have the capacity to be honest."

So, as you can see, this passage is Bill W. bitchslapping anybody who doesn't stay sober in A.A. That's how AA lets itself off the hook, "if our program doesn't work, it's because you are a loser, we pity you" I always resented this passage and how Bill W claimed his young organization infallible. So arrogant and against so many of the good things he preaches in the book. They read this passage from a laminated sheet of paper at the beginning of every meeting, and I would volunteer to read it aloud in a sort of effort to come to terms with it. I never did.

The last relapse was different, I wasn't going to guilt trip myself this time, I knew I wasn't going back to AA and the guilt lifted. Yet I felt horrible about the way I was drinking and was desperate to find a solution. It occurred to me that AA just wasn't working and there must be another way, So I searched online. I don't remember what I typed into google, but I stumbled upon The Cure for Alcoholism on Amazon. Things have felt good since! I think I googled cure, or searched amazon for cure, which makes me glad Eskapa used the term in his title. I had been on vivitrol "(injectable Nal) with instructions to abstain, but drank anyway ond guilt tripped and went back to AA. My shrink is a fan of Nal, so I brought her the Book. She was open minded enough to try it with me. Glad to have found this and all you people. You really inspire me and give me hope, thanks

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 Post subject: Re: How did you learn about TSM?
PostPosted: Sat Sep 04, 2010 2:09 pm 
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Joined: Wed Jun 02, 2010 4:30 pm
Posts: 278
Location: USA
I was reading yet another self-help book to try to quit drinking on my own (I never went to AA because I had studied it from afar and knew instinctively that it would not be the right fit for me.)

In the book, "Sex, Drugs, Gambling and Chocolate: A Workbook for Overcoming Addictions", there is a section about pharmaceutical help in addiction treatment. This section described Naltrexone as a drug to help reduce cravings while abstinent. But it also mentioned that nothing bad happens if you DO drink while taking Naltrexone.

Well, that got me VERY interested, thinking "why couldn't you be mostly abstinent and still use Naltrexone to help with cravings?" A few Google searches later and I ran across TSM.

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First Start Date: June 1, 2010; Second Start Date November 1, 2012
Pre-TSM: 35-50 units per wk / 0 AF days


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 Post subject: Re: How did you learn about TSM?
PostPosted: Sun Sep 05, 2010 3:28 pm 
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Joined: Fri Sep 03, 2010 5:02 pm
Posts: 90
hi,I would also like to add my motivation for even searching for another way..See,all those years in Aa had me confused..It simply conflicted with my beliefs and self knowledge..I had been to confession dozens of times,I have always tried to maitain healthy relationships,Etc..But Aa kept saying no,you're not being honest..It was wierd,I was making stuff up just to fit in.Anyways,I also read the bible and go to church..Everything I ever learned about when god heals,told me this praying for a daily reprieve was nonsense..So I started praying for a cure..When I finally got frustrated enough this last time I left aa and started reading the orange papers..One other thing I believe and always did,is that God created Alcohol and even drank it himself and was accused by the zealots of his day of being a drunkard..Anyway,Im not pushing religion,just saying it was in part,my religious beliefs that helped me see that aa and its higher power concept was not for me..I also am starting to believe this may be the cure that i was praying for..To me a cure is not abstinence a cure would be a choice..I would like to choose whether or not to drink,not be driven to it because of addiction or affraid of it because of fear..So yes,if tsm works for me I will consider it a gift..Have a good day all


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 Post subject: Re: How did you learn about TSM?
PostPosted: Sun Sep 05, 2010 9:22 pm 
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Joined: Sun Jun 27, 2010 6:52 pm
Posts: 176
I'd been doing some research on the Web about alcoholism and ran across a piece on baclofen and how it helped some people reduce their drinking. As a freelancer writer I do a lot of this kind of research, so I started Googling baclofen and found this site, which mentioned both bac and nal. Which sounds a lot like bacchanal, but bear with me. I first tried baclofen, but the low dosages by doc put me on didn't really help, although it gave me a glimpse of what life without an alcohol craving could be like. One of the sites that had mentioned baclofen also mentioned naltrexone. It was www.thesinclairmethod.net. After doing a few weeks of baclofen, I went back to my doc and requested naltrexone. I showed him the "For Physicians" part of the book I downloaded from the site. He was already familiar with the way Chantix worked for smokers, blocking the nicotine receptors that prompted nicotine addiction, so recognized the possibilities immediately and wrote me a script. Three months later, I'm still on track and hoping for a good outcome, although I realize there is a significant percentage for whom nal just won't work.

I should also mention my experience with AA, or in my case, NA. My therapist sent me to NA because of my binge drinking, and I immediately felt like a fish out of water. According to them, my drinking was caused by some character defect. I was, to hear them tell it, damaged goods. But I could make it all better by towing the NA line, which is pretty much the same as AA. I went to a couple of meetings, but soon realized that for most of these folks, the meetings had taken the place of alcohol in their lives - it was just another form of addiction. I started researching AA, and that's when my eyes opened even wider.

Alcoholics Anonymous was founded by Bill Wilson in the mid-Thirties after he hit the proverbial rock bottom. He was actually given hallucinogens at a rescue mission in which he saw a vision he later described as "meeting God," which engendered in him the task of saving other poor souls like himself from a life of alcoholism. He became a student of philosopher Williams James, who believed that suffering was the only way to spiritual transformation, which became the seed of AA's "you are all damaged" philosophy. In other words, AA is espousing the teachings of a man who had a vision under the influence of a hallucination. Sounds a little like Scientology, doesn't it?

Now take a look at TSM, which is based on a sound scientific principle stating that the opiod receptors alcohol binds to can be blocked by Naltrexone, causing the alcohol to become ineffective as an intoxicant, and that repeated blocking results in pharmacological extinction of alcohol cravings. Which one sounds more appealing? Yes, AA has a certain limited effectiveness among a small group of people. And god bless 'em, they've found what they're looking for. But for the vast majority of people for whom the religion-based...I'm gonna say cult...has not worked, I think TSM is a kinder, less accusatory solution that doesn't require the demolition of one's self-image in order to work.

Whew. OK, lemme get off my soapbox here. I admit I'm a little biased here, and I'm one hundred percent in favor of whatever works. But I hate to see folks down on themselves because of a chemical imbalance that in some quarters equals a character flaw. Let's hope the truth spreads quickly.


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 Post subject: Re: How did you learn about TSM?
PostPosted: Thu Sep 09, 2010 11:56 am 
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Joined: Sat Nov 21, 2009 5:23 pm
Posts: 210
I was desperate and joined MWO..I threw my story up and everyone was like go to rehab...not an option for me..i would have died crown royal in hand prior to joining AA again. This one ANGEL of a woman sent a PM about TSM. I first I thought what a sick individual to try and sell the desperate and suffering..ie I thought it was an infomercial. Well, it's no infomercial and nothing to sell and profit off. That was 11 months ago and I added my name to the cured list 7 months ago. That PM from that woman saved and restored my life. I owe her bigtime. I have looked for her in the forums here and over there but cant find her. I would LOVE to tell her thank -you. I say a little prayer just about everynight that she is ok and doing well.


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 Post subject: Re: How did you learn about TSM?
PostPosted: Thu Sep 09, 2010 3:50 pm 
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Joined: Fri Mar 05, 2010 2:34 pm
Posts: 12
I learned about TSM from our fellow forum member Jim Clark. He had been keeping me posted on his progress for a few months and then when I relapsed last winter gave me the encouragement to try TSM. For this he gets an eternal thank you!


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 Post subject: Re: How did you learn about TSM?
PostPosted: Thu Sep 09, 2010 6:27 pm 
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Joined: Mon Sep 14, 2009 2:53 pm
Posts: 511
Location: Massachusetts
Internet found the book and then read it. The rest is as they say history. Jim
Thanks Jerry,....back at ya :D


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