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 Post subject: Found another study :/
PostPosted: Sun Dec 13, 2009 9:34 pm 
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I don't know how I missed this one. It's a very large multi-center study with 600 initial subjects where they tested targeted nalmefene for 7 months. The results were statistically significant and positive but IMO unimpressive. The nalmefene group reduce their consumption by about 40% in 7 months.

This one's too big for me to try to cut and paste it out of PDF form so if someone would like to offer up a domain I'll upload it so anyone can get it.

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Graph Of My Units Over 182 Days

Weeks 0-26: 80, 65, 97, 90, 80, 101, 104, 83, 83, 88, 91, 83, 100, 39, 32, 71, 51, 34, 4.5, 0, 5, 3, 6, 11, 0, 0, 0u

I'll always naltreksonipillerin advance

---Lo0p (resident geek :roll: )


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 Post subject: Re: Found another study :/
PostPosted: Mon Dec 14, 2009 6:49 am 
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Lo0p wrote:
This one's too big for me to try to cut and paste it out of PDF form so if someone would like to offer up a domain I'll upload it so anyone can get it.
Stick it on Rapidshare and provide a link. It'll remain there for 60 days at no cost to you or any downloader.

Bob

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Code:
Pre-TSM~54u/Wk
Wk1-52:40,42,39,28,33,33,43,40,36,30,34,30,30║30,38,13,25,4,22,12,6,9,5,9,3,5║6,6,5,4,9,6,0,9,2,2,5,4,4║3,4,5,3,4,2,6,2,6,4,8,2,2u
W53-91: 4, 2, 2, 2, 3, 2, 1, 5, 4,17, 0, 0, 0║ 3, 0, 3, 0,3, 0, 2,0,0,0,0,0,0║0,0,0,2,0,2,0,0,3,0,0,2,0u
"Cured" @ Week 21 (5 Months),         Current Week: 97  (23rd Month)


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 Post subject: Re: Found another study :/
PostPosted: Mon Dec 14, 2009 6:56 am 
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http://rapidshare.com/files/320711475/nalmefene.pdf.html

Thanks bob!

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Graph Of My Units Over 182 Days

Weeks 0-26: 80, 65, 97, 90, 80, 101, 104, 83, 83, 88, 91, 83, 100, 39, 32, 71, 51, 34, 4.5, 0, 5, 3, 6, 11, 0, 0, 0u

I'll always naltreksonipillerin advance

---Lo0p (resident geek :roll: )


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 Post subject: Re: Found another study :/
PostPosted: Mon Dec 14, 2009 7:13 am 
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Joined: Sun Mar 15, 2009 7:40 pm
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Location: Florida
Lo0p wrote:
Sure thing. I just downloaded it, but I can't read it since I just upgraded my hard disk and loaded Windows 7 (64 bit). I have yet to pull over all my data and apps from my Vista disk. Anyway, don't even have Acrobat reader installed yet, but I'll get to it this morning. I'm on vacation this week so I have lots of time.

Bob

_________________
Code:
Pre-TSM~54u/Wk
Wk1-52:40,42,39,28,33,33,43,40,36,30,34,30,30║30,38,13,25,4,22,12,6,9,5,9,3,5║6,6,5,4,9,6,0,9,2,2,5,4,4║3,4,5,3,4,2,6,2,6,4,8,2,2u
W53-91: 4, 2, 2, 2, 3, 2, 1, 5, 4,17, 0, 0, 0║ 3, 0, 3, 0,3, 0, 2,0,0,0,0,0,0║0,0,0,2,0,2,0,0,3,0,0,2,0u
"Cured" @ Week 21 (5 Months),         Current Week: 97  (23rd Month)


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 Post subject: Re: Found another study :/
PostPosted: Tue Dec 15, 2009 5:23 pm 
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Posts: 18
Hi Loop,

Thanks for sharing the article. My opinion however is a bit different.

The nalmefene group _reported_ reduction of their consumption by almost 47% after 7 months but all the reduction occurred in 1 month. The placebo group reported 37% reduction after 7 months.
Unfortunately the only thing that this study shows is that there's a huge difference between what people say and what they do. When a carbohydrate-deficient transferrin level was measured it showed reduction for the nalmefene group from 3.3 to 3.1 vs 3.4 to 3.3. Does it sound promising?

One optimistic thing is that more people from the placebo group left the study because they didn’t see any improvement. Besides (if this helps) I know many studies that say obese people don't lose weight on low-carb but I personally don't know anybody who doesn't lose at least 0.5 kg per week.


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 Post subject: Re: Found another study :/
PostPosted: Wed Dec 16, 2009 11:26 pm 
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Posts: 872
testing...I have posted on 2 or 3 other threads for mere seconds and get a "time's up" message. What's up widdat??

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Began TSM 2/09 ave 35 - 50 units/wk
Months 6 - 12 @ 100mgs
2/10 Dropped to 50mgs; units same
4/10 stopped NAL & started BAC thru River
6/10 up to 120 mgs BAC w/ MAJOR SEs
7/10 titrating off BAC
8/10 starting Topamax w/ Dr.


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 Post subject: Re: Found another study :/
PostPosted: Thu Dec 17, 2009 10:47 pm 
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Posts: 14
Have to read this carefully yet but the first impression is that the effects were real but moderate. Looking at the "cured" list and the original 2001 paper, it looks like TSM might be more effective for "moderate" drinkers (an average problem drinker in Sinclair's 2001 study sounds like a moderate drinker to me :( )
Is it possible that the subjects in this one were heavier drinkers / simply more addicted?

On the other hand, while browsing recently, I came across a rat study (published few years ago) which is somewhat unsetting - if true and if applicable to humans. In brief, it went like TSM with rats and experimental group did drink considerably less. So far so good. However, within 3-4 days after withdrawal of NAL, the experimental group started to drink a lot more - exceeding levels of control group and exceeding its own pre-NAL levels. Can't find it again right now because the key words are too generic and there are too many hits returned. I will find it if anyone is interested.


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 Post subject: Re: Found another study :/
PostPosted: Fri Dec 18, 2009 11:53 am 
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Ortho -- Sinclair found the same thing in his rat studies. No time to look it up but it's in the shrinkrap podcast and in Eskapa's book. The rats respond to nal (i.e. show extinction) in days rather than weeks or months. And they re-learn (i.e. get re-addicted) drinking in days when not on nal. It takes weeks or months for humans but it is certain to happen. That's why it's essential that we always take nal before drinking -- always.

Many of us who were heavy drinkers find it takes far longer than the three-to-six month period for significant changes. And many of us, while pleased with the reduction in our consumption, are far from "cured" as Eskapa defines it in his book, after several months.

For me, it helps to remember is that Sinclair found his subjects continued to report a reduction in craving for as long as three years after the onset of treatment.


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