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 Post subject: abstinence or TSM
PostPosted: Wed Jun 03, 2009 6:14 pm 
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Joined: Wed Jun 03, 2009 5:53 pm
Posts: 8
Hi,

I am a spouse of an alcoholic in need of an answer to a difficult question. I have just discovered the Sinclair Method, at the same time that my husband has committed to abstinence--after a very rocky period. He did a complete year of abstinence in 2007, then relapsed into increasingly heavy drinking. This brought our 37 year marriage to the brink last month--hence his commitment to be abstinent. I've ordered Eskarpa's book, and am sold on the science behind it--it finally explains the mystery of why my loving, kind, and generous husband has continued to engage in such hurtful behaviour. But I am frankly wondering whether to even tell him about TSM now that he's finally agreed to be abstinent. He's only 3 days into abstinence, so its seems like now is the time to tell him if I am going that route. I know this should be his decision, but this has become the deal breaker in our marriage, and I'm afraid that it may lead him back to drinking and the end of the marriage.

I have read many posts and find many wise souls on this board--I would really appreciate any advice you can give me. Is this the right time to start TSM, or should we put this in our back pocket to use in case of a relapse? Anything but abstinence scares me, but on the other hand, if TSM will give him a peace that "white knuckling it will not", I guess want to give him that option.

You are all so brave. My hat is off to each and every one of you.


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 Post subject: Re: abstinence or TSM
PostPosted: Wed Jun 03, 2009 6:24 pm 
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Joined: Mon Feb 23, 2009 12:07 pm
Posts: 386
Location: Michigan
Hey Hopeful,

In your situation, with only 3 days of abstinence, you owe it to your husband to tell him about TSM. If you've both been through hell for so many years, why not look at all the possibilities? Sounds like he is a wonderful man, and you are an incredible partner to support him like this. Go for it! We'll be here to support both of you. Keep writing, whatever your decision. All the best to you. :D


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 Post subject: Re: abstinence or TSM
PostPosted: Wed Jun 03, 2009 7:18 pm 
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Joined: Wed Apr 08, 2009 6:26 pm
Posts: 62
Location: Southern California
Hi Hopeful,

Yes, absolutely tell him! You do not want him to white knuckle this for the rest of his life, suffering incredibly from this addiction, when there is a cure to be had!

_________________
Pre-SM: 150+ units/Craving 10+

Wk/Units/Craving
1: ...85 ......3
2: ...125 ....9
3: underway


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 Post subject: Re: abstinence or TSM
PostPosted: Wed Jun 03, 2009 7:36 pm 
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Joined: Thu Feb 05, 2009 2:07 pm
Posts: 929
Here is what Dr. Eskapa says in the book: "If you are currently abstinently abstinent, unless you are relapsing, there is no valid reason to start the treatment. You are to be commended -- stay with your current treatment if it is working for you." (p. 88).

Is 3 days alcohol-free (you will se it as AF) abstinence? I doubt many would say it is. Is your husband currently under a treatment regime other than white-knuckling? Doesn't seem so from your post.

Please read the letter from Dr. Eskapa to a concerned spouse about alcohol deprivation effect. Short AF periods can lead to even heavier drinking.

I am thankful you found us and are such a loving, supportive spouse. Most of us most do this without the support of spouse or family because it seems so counter-intuitive to endorse a treatment that permits -- requires -- drinking for success. The conventional wisdom (12-step) is that tolerating drinking is "enabling" but here it is just the opposite for a short time (a few months). Please read everything you can on this board until the book arrives, then read it over and over.

And please, be merciful to your husband and share this with him.


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 Post subject: Re: abstinence or TSM
PostPosted: Wed Jun 03, 2009 7:41 pm 
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Joined: Mon Feb 09, 2009 2:10 pm
Posts: 316
Location: Chicago, IL
Wow - I wish all spouses were like you, you are awesome to consider this after what I'm sure he's put you through.

Maybe you can tell him about it as Plan B. Encourage him to stay abstinent but give him the book, point him here, and make a doctor's appt to see if he can get a script just in case (if you have insurance the cost should be minimal). If he doesn't want to go to a doctor then if it were me, I'd order the Nal for him just in case...then you can encourage him to start TSM if he relapses.

Best of luck to you both either way. I know it's very hard and unfair living with people with alcohol issues, so my warm wishes to you especially as you help him through this. I hope you find success.


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 Post subject: Re: abstinence or TSM
PostPosted: Thu Jun 04, 2009 9:11 am 
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Joined: Thu Feb 05, 2009 4:27 pm
Posts: 729
Location: New York State
Here's what I would do: I'd go online and order the naltrexone to have on hand, just in case.

I would say nothing to my husband about it, so long as he is successfully abstinent. Why fix what is apparently not currently broken? He's gotten through three days - and usually that third day is a killer. Now, if he can get through three weeks, he has a great chance of success. If he gets past three months - bingo!

However, we all know there's a great possibility of relapse. So, if/when that happens, introduce him to Plan B: TSM.

Alternatively - and this might be better yet, in your case - check out Dr. Olivier Ameisen's book, The End of my Addiction. In it he describes another treatment drug, baclofen, that is safe, non-addictive, and effectively eliminates the craving for alcohol. The author was a die-hard, 'hopeless' alcoholic who had to give up his highly successful cardiac practice because of his drinking. Baclofen has completely cured him - he can even have a glass of wine on occasion, if he desires, and it doesn't reawaken his craving. Some folks on the My Way Out forum are experiencing dramatic effects. As long as your husband is now abstinent, I'm betting the baclofen will help keep him that way, without all the painful temptations and white-knuckling.

Kudos to you, and good luck for both of you!


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 Post subject: Re: abstinence or TSM
PostPosted: Thu Jun 04, 2009 9:31 am 
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You should know that not all of us share G4M's opinion that baclofen is safe and non-addictive.
viewtopic.php?f=7&t=441&start=10


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 Post subject: Re: abstinence or TSM
PostPosted: Thu Jun 04, 2009 10:23 am 
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Joined: Wed Jun 03, 2009 5:53 pm
Posts: 8
Thank you all for your thoughtful responses. The book was on my doorstep when I arrived home last night after posting my question --and I decided to go ahead and give it to my husband. He took one look at the title-- "drink you way sober without willpower, abstinence or discomfort"--and said "this is going to sell a million copies, but it sounds like crap". I've probably given him 50 books on how to stop drinking (could you tell from my first post that I've become addicted to trying to stop his addiction?) so this just seemed like another run of the mill blather. But then we took a couple of hours to sit and talk about it--rare to have those on a weeknight with two kids at home. The bottom line is that--much to my relief--he has decided to read the book, but continue to dedicate himself to staying abstinent. (One of my concerns about him trying TSM is that he starts at 9 am on the weekends, and my understanding of the method is that you are supposed to stay with your nomal drinking times and amounts--so he would be going back to being drunk again by noon every weekend until this started to work for him. And as my teenaged daughter would say--that just sucks.) I think he is thinking of this as a backup Plan B if things go south again for him. Hopefully that gives him the same peace of mind that it gives me. In the meantime, I'm intrigued by the possibility that baclofen may help him--but appreciate your warning lena, and will approach the idea with caution. We have a son with an anxiety disorder, and I have long wondered if my husband could have some anxiety issues that drive this beast.

We're going on a 2 week extended-family vacation to Maui soon--so this will be the ultimate test of his new abstinence program. I've promised to be his sober buddy (I drink occasionally, enjoy it on vacation, but 2 is my limit). He keeps telling me it's not necessary, but I want to do it for him and I think if I were in his shoes it would help me.

I'll continue to read your posts and follow you all in your journey, and maybe my husband will be joining you someday. If I'm not butting in on your program, I may want to post questions from time to time. I find your responses to be intelligent and well thought out--and there's nothing like the voice of experience. I wish you all the very best of luck and great success.


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 Post subject: Re: abstinence or TSM
PostPosted: Thu Jun 04, 2009 11:49 am 
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Joined: Wed Apr 08, 2009 8:09 am
Posts: 437
Hopeful, I think I speak for all of us here when I say that we would be more than willing to help in any way we can. Come back and post to your heart's content!

_________________
Pre Sinclair 60-100 units
Month 1 Av. 62 units
Month 2 Av. 68 Units
Month 3 Av. 58 Units
Month 4 Av 47.5 Units
Month 5 Av 48.5 Units
Month 6 Av. 30.7
Month 7 Av. 32.2
Month 8 Av. 39.7
Wk34 50Units
Wk 35 40U 1AF
Wk 36 4U 6AF


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 Post subject: Re: abstinence or TSM
PostPosted: Thu Jun 04, 2009 5:33 pm 
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Joined: Sun Mar 15, 2009 7:40 pm
Posts: 962
Location: Florida
Hopeful -

I am a 51 year-old man of 32 years marriage who happens to be a college graduate with US State professional credentials and hold several security clearances. In other words, I'm just some guy.

I am glad you told him of TSM and that he has agreed to read the book. I expect him to read it with the same "grain-of-salt" attitude as I had when I read it. It is sound science.

I did the abstinence/relapse ordeal about 30 times in almost five years. Now, I have real hope and currently see actual changes occurring in my thoughts and drinking patterns. I have not yet been "cured", but it is only a matter of time. Men are not, by large, inherently patient. I know I am not. But, I will perform this method until the end of 2009... 9 months to prove that it is effective. Other men have tried and succeeded. I can too. He can too.

Show him this post. That men are doing this after having been through the other failed methodologies.

Bob

_________________
Code:
Pre-TSM~54u/Wk
Wk1-52:40,42,39,28,33,33,43,40,36,30,34,30,30║30,38,13,25,4,22,12,6,9,5,9,3,5║6,6,5,4,9,6,0,9,2,2,5,4,4║3,4,5,3,4,2,6,2,6,4,8,2,2u
W53-91: 4, 2, 2, 2, 3, 2, 1, 5, 4,17, 0, 0, 0║ 3, 0, 3, 0,3, 0, 2,0,0,0,0,0,0║0,0,0,2,0,2,0,0,3,0,0,2,0u
"Cured" @ Week 21 (5 Months),         Current Week: 97  (23rd Month)


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